User:Flynnjed/Sandbox3: Difference between revisions

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This argument is an example the fallacy of Petitio Principi ('Circular Reasoning' or assuming in the premise of an argument that which one wishes to prove in the conclusion).  
This argument is an example the fallacy of Petitio Principi ('Circular Reasoning' or assuming in the premise of an argument that which one wishes to prove in the conclusion).  


('''NB''' {{Quran|2|195}} - referenced in the quote at the start of this section - forbids suicide and ''self''-mutilation, and is therefore does not apply to FGM)  
('''NB''' {{Quran|2|195}} - referenced in the quote at the start of this section - forbids suicide and '''''self'''''-mutilation, and therefore does not apply to FGM)  


==='Circumcision' is not Mutilation===
==='Circumcision' is not Mutilation===
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The limited, prescribed religious ritual of female circumcision has been regrettably deemed by the WHO to be a form of female genital mutilation [...] The classification of female circumcision as FGM “reinforces the image of female circumcision as a barbaric one, practiced by an uncivilised people.” Conflating the practice of female circumcision with mutilation prohibits any possibility of impartiality in considering the practice as a legitimate, protected religious rite.}}
The limited, prescribed religious ritual of female circumcision has been regrettably deemed by the WHO to be a form of female genital mutilation [...] The classification of female circumcision as FGM “reinforces the image of female circumcision as a barbaric one, practiced by an uncivilised people.” Conflating the practice of female circumcision with mutilation prohibits any possibility of impartiality in considering the practice as a legitimate, protected religious rite.}}
The term ''<nowiki/>'Female Circumcision''' is sometimes used by those who consider certain practices as insufficiently harmful or intrusive to merit the epithet 'mutilation' (as in 'Female Genital ''Mutilation').''  
The term ''<nowiki/>'''Female Circumcision' is used by those who consider certain practices insufficiently harmful or intrusive to merit the epithet 'mutilation' (as in 'Female Genital ''Mutilation')'' and can be applied to any procedure short of infibulation''.''<ref>[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233100651_Somali_Women_in_Western_Exile_Reassessing_Female_Circumcision_in_the_Light_of_Islamic_Teachings Somali Women in Western Exile: Reassessing Female Circumcision in the Light of Islamic Teachings] Sara Johnsdotter</ref> The relatively moderate procedure of the ''"removal of the clitoral hood or a ritual nick on the external female genitalia"'' is called 'Sunnah Circumcision'.<ref>[https://femalecircumcision.org/a-problem-of-definition-female-circumcision-vs-fgm/ A Problem of Definition: Female Circumcision vs FGM]</ref>


One such practice is the ''"removal of the clitoral hood or a ritual nick on the external female genitalia"''<ref>[https://femalecircumcision.org/a-problem-of-definition-female-circumcision-vs-fgm/ A Problem of Definition: Female Circumcision vs FGM]</ref>. This is sometimes called 'Sunnah Circumcision' (though this term can be used to denote any form of FGM other than infibulation<ref>[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233100651_Somali_Women_in_Western_Exile_Reassessing_Female_Circumcision_in_the_Light_of_Islamic_Teachings Somali Women in Western Exile: Reassessing Female Circumcision in the Light of Islamic Teachings] Sara Johnsdotter</ref>). It is mostly practiced by South Asian Muslims, who belong to the Shafi'i school, which makes FGM obligatory and is associated with the most severe form of FGM, infibulation. Sunnah circumcision may have been a way of fulfilling this obligation whilst sparing girls the extremities of infibulation. Infibulation would have been a practice alien to South Asian Muslims, since it is arose with the Islamic slave trade, which largely spared South Asia.<ref>[https://www.librairie-de-flore.fr/produit/esclavage-lhistoire-a-lendroit/ l'Esclavage: l'Histoire à l'Endroit' by Bernard Lugan (2020)]</ref><ref>[https://www.pen-and-sword.co.uk/The-Forgotten-Slave-Trade-Hardback/p/18473 The Forgotten Slave Trade - the White European Slaves of Islam] by Simon Webb</ref>  
Sunnah Circumcision is mostly practiced by South Asian Muslims, who belong to the Shafi'i school, which makes FGM obligatory and is associated with the most severe form of FGM, infibulation. Infibulation would have been a practice alien to South Asian Muslims, arising as it did from the Islamic slave trade, which largely spared South Asia.<ref>[https://www.librairie-de-flore.fr/produit/esclavage-lhistoire-a-lendroit/ l'Esclavage: l'Histoire à l'Endroit' by Bernard Lugan (2020)]</ref><ref>[https://www.pen-and-sword.co.uk/The-Forgotten-Slave-Trade-Hardback/p/18473 The Forgotten Slave Trade - the White European Slaves of Islam] by Simon Webb</ref> Sunnah circumcision may have been a way of sparing girls the extremities of infibulation whilst still fulfilling the obligation to engage in FGM.


Granted that 'Sunnah Circumcision' is a ''lesser'' mutilation than full clitoridectomy (or excision or infibulation) it nevertheless remains a mutilation because:
Granted that 'Sunnah Circumcision' is a ''lesser'' mutilation than full clitoridectomy, excision or infibulation, it nevertheless remains a mutilation because:


*it serves no medical or prophylactic purpose
#it serves no medical or prophylactic purpose
*it damages the functioning of an important body part (amongst other things, permanent exposure reduces the sensitivity of the clitoris)
#it damages the functioning of an important body part (e.g. permanent exposure reduces the sensitivity of the clitoris)
*it unnecessarily exposes the child to  health risks, both short-term and long-term<ref>[https://www.who.int/teams/sexual-and-reproductive-health-and-research/areas-of-work/female-genital-mutilation/health-risks-of-female-genital-mutilation Health risks of female genital mutilation (FGM)] WHO</ref>
#it unnecessarily exposes the child to  health risks, both short-term and long-term<ref>[https://www.who.int/teams/sexual-and-reproductive-health-and-research/areas-of-work/female-genital-mutilation/health-risks-of-female-genital-mutilation Health risks of female genital mutilation (FGM)] WHO</ref>
*it is generally done in needlessly traumatic manner - anaesthetics are generally eschewed<!-- link to FGM as initiation rite -->
#it is generally done in a needlessly traumatic manner: anaesthetics are generally eschewed<!-- link to FGM as initiation rite -->
*it is practiced on children, who can not give informed consent to such a procedure
#it is practiced on children, who can not give informed consent to such a procedure
*though children can not consent to this procedure, they can ''refuse'' consent or ''withdraw'' it (this is signaled by the child struggling to escape the procedure or begging for it to stop). However this refusal/withdrawal of consent is generally not respected by those carrying out the procedure
#though children can not consent to this procedure, they ''can'' refuse consent or withdraw it (signaled by the child struggling to escape the procedure or begging for it to stop). However the child's consent-decision is rarely respected by those carrying out the procedure


The removal of the clitoral prepuce is justified by [[Daleel|Qiyas]] as being analogous to male circumcision. Proponents of this position accuse bodies such as the World Health Organisation of double standards in that they condemn 'Sunnah Circumcision' but not Male Circumcision.   
The removal of the clitoral prepuce is justified by [[Daleel|Qiyas]] as being analogous to male circumcision. Proponents of this position accuse bodies such as the World Health Organisation of double standards in that they condemn 'Sunnah Circumcision' but not Male Circumcision.   


If one accepts that ritual male circumcision is not mutilation then their position seems coherent. However, the above-listed characteristics apply equally to male circumcision, and thus male circumcision is a mutilation. The failure of such bodies to classify male circumcision as a mutilation is a political and pragmatic decision, not one based on ethics or an objective evaluation of the practice - the practice is simply too widespread and too accepted for a body such as the WHO to condemn (it is estimated that 38.7% of males are circumcises, with 68% of that figure being Muslim men<ref>[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4772313/ Estimation of country-specific and global prevalence of male circumcision - Brian J Morris et al.] (2016)</ref>).     
If one accepts that ritual male circumcision is not mutilation then their position seems coherent. However, the six above-listed characteristics apply equally to male circumcision, and thus male circumcision is a mutilation. The failure of the WHO and other bodies to classify male circumcision as a mutilation is a political and pragmatic decision, not one based on ethics or an objective evaluation of the practice. Male circumcision is simply too widespread and too entrenched for such organisations to condemn (it is estimated that 38.7% of males are circumcised, with 68% of that figure being Muslim men<ref>[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4772313/ Estimation of country-specific and global prevalence of male circumcision - Brian J Morris et al.] (2016)</ref>).     


The argument that 'Sunnah Circumcision' should be allowed because Male Circumcision is allowed is to argue that because Evil X is tolerated Evil Y should therefore also be tolerated'. The WHO etc should aspire to be consistent by condemning ''both'' practices, not by condoning both.   
The argument that 'Sunnah Circumcision' should be allowed because Male Circumcision is allowed is to argue that Evil X should be allowed because Evil Y is allowed. The WHO etc should achieve coherence by condemning ''both'' practices, not by condoning them.   


'<nowiki/>''NB''' - no-one who practices, or defends, FGM refers to what they do as 'mutilation', not even those who infibulate. This is especially so for Muslims, since the Qur'an appears to forbid mutilation ({{Quran|30|30}}, {{Quran|2|195}} - but see [[User:Flynnjed/Sandbox#The Qur.27an Forbids Mutilation|previous section]]). The line which separates '''''<nowiki/>'''<nowiki/>'justified intervention'<nowiki/>'' and ''<nowiki/>'mutilation''' is therefore always set somewhere beyond the practice being defended. The fact that a Muslim condemns 'Female Genital Mutilation' but on further discussion, reveal themselves to support 'Female ''circumcision'.'' 
'''NB -''' no-one who practices, or defends, FGM refers to what they do as 'mutilation', not even those who infibulate. This is especially so for Muslims, since the Qur'an appears to forbid mutilation ({{Quran|30|30}}, {{Quran|2|195}} - but see [[User:Flynnjed/Sandbox#The Qur.27an Forbids Mutilation|previous section]]). The line which separates 'justified intervention' and 'mutilation is therefore always set somewhere beyond the practice being defended. It can happen that a Muslim will condemn 'Female Genital Mutilation' but on further discussion, reveal themselves to support 'Female circumcision'.


<nowiki/><nowiki/>'''<nowiki/><nowiki/><nowiki/>'''
===There Is No Record of Muhammad Having His Wives or Daughters Circumcised===
===There Is No Record of Muhammad Having His Wives or Daughters Circumcised===
{{Quote|[https://archive.ph/2021.04.09-045325/https://courtingthelaw.com/2016/04/28/commentary/islam-and-female-genital-mutilation-fgm/#selection-1263.35-1263.257 Islam And Female Genital Mutilation (FGM)]|The Holy Prophet Muhammad (SAW) had four daughters and '''we have no strong sources to prove if even one of them was circumcised''', therefore it can be concluded that this practice has no strong reasons to be called as Islamic.}}
{{Quote|[https://archive.ph/2021.04.09-045325/https://courtingthelaw.com/2016/04/28/commentary/islam-and-female-genital-mutilation-fgm/#selection-1263.35-1263.257 Islam And Female Genital Mutilation (FGM)]|The Holy Prophet Muhammad (SAW) had four daughters and '''we have no strong sources to prove if even one of them was circumcised''', therefore it can be concluded that this practice has no strong reasons to be called as Islamic.}}
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